Discussion:
Johnny Cash- Scottish?
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Jim Stewart
2003-09-17 03:09:30 UTC
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In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?

Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....

Jim Stewart
Greyrover
2003-09-17 04:38:24 UTC
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Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Don't know about that but heard in the '60's that Johnny Cash was
one-eighth Cherokee. Actually, the answer might be on the album "Bitter
Tears" if I still have it unpacked.

Greyrover
Madra Dubh
2003-09-18 00:19:18 UTC
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Post by Greyrover
Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Don't know about that but heard in the '60's that Johnny Cash was
one-eighth Cherokee. Actually, the answer might be on the album "Bitter
Tears" if I still have it unpacked.
He probably was, Greyrover.
Not only are us Cherokee good looking, we can all sing.
Hey Rick, giz a few bars of "Old Joe Clark".
Scottish
2003-09-17 07:42:15 UTC
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http://www.strathmiglo.freeserve.co.uk/history/history.htm

CASH

'villa' or toun of Westercasse, dated 1294, from Joseph Stevenson, Documents
Illustrative of the History of Scotland 1286-1306, 416 [in Strathmigloshire]
Esterchasse, 1294 ibid., 417 [in Strathmigloshire]

Estir Casche, 1451 Exchequer Rolls v 468

to John Bykkertoun son and heir of Alexander B. of Casche the
lands of Casche with their grain-mill and waulk-mill, 1502 RMS (= Register
of the Great Seal) ii no.2647

to Sir William Scott of Balwery the lands of Estir Casche, Westir
Casche with its tower and mill and the west mill of Strethmeglo with its
lands of the west part of the said toun [of Strethmeglo], and 24 acres of
lands of the toun of Pitgorno adjacent to the west end of the toun of
Strethmeglo...and these lands of Estir Casche etc. were united in the barony
of Strethmeglo.... Also common pasture for the lands of Casche and Falkland
in le Lummontis and the muir on the north side of these hills, 1529 RMS iii
no.760

Item ..gevin in to Casche quhar the kingis grace drank he beand at
the huntyn, xii s. 17 April 1540 ‘Accounts of the King’s Pursemaster 1539-40
Scottish History Society Miscellany 10 (1965), 43 [i.e. 12 shillings paid to
Cash for providing King James V with drink while he was out hunting]

Eister Casche was made exempt from feu-duties as compensation for
part of its lands having been enclosed and joined to the royal wood of
Falkland. This decision was taken at the Parliament held in Perth in 1606,
noted in RMS vii no.644

the piece of land lie Raecreuk [= Raecruik, Strathmiglo parish]
next to Eister Casche 1612 RMS vii no.644



The name Cash probably comes from the Gaelic word càise 'cheese' (pronounced
‘kahshu’ - ‘u’ as in ‘cup’). When Cash first enters the written record in
1294 it forms part of the shire of Strathmiglo, held by the earls of Fife.
It was probably part of the lands of Strathmiglo which were given to Duncan
earl of Fife about 1160 by King Malcolm IV (Regesta Regum Scottorum i
no.190), so it was originally what is termed royal demesne i.e. land owned
directly by the king, and managed for the needs of the court.

Originally Cash clearly specialised in producing cheese, which
would have been for direct consumption by the king, and later by the earl,
his household and his retainers. The name must have been coined while Gaelic
was the main language of Fife i.e from about 850-1200 A.D., probably earlier
rather than later in that period.

It can be compared with a similar name, Goatmilk, on the other
side of the Lomonds in Kinglassie parish, which also lay on royal demesne
land. It was given by King Alexander I (1107-24) to Dunfermline Abbey. It
obviously specialised in the production of goat-milk.

The name is discussed briefly by the Scottish medieval historian
Professor Geoffrey Barrow in his book The Kingdom of the Scots (London,
1973) 278.
--
Scottish
Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Jim Stewart
Scottish
2003-09-17 07:43:15 UTC
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http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2003/09/15/newsstory5153619t0.asp

THE DEATH of country music legend Johnny Cash on Friday has brought into
focus his family’s 800-year-old link with the Howe of Fife.

The US star could trace his ancestry back to King Malcolm IV of Scotland and
had links with the former country retreat of the Stuart kings at Falkland
Palace.

Records held by Falkland Palace show that King Malcolm awarded a large
estate to the Earl of Fife in 1160 when he married the king’s niece, whose
name was Cash or Cashel. A 15th century map sited the estate between
Falkland and Strathmiglo.

The clan Cash originated from Malcolm’s sister, Ada, and streets in
Strathmiglo and Falkland still carry the name Cash, as do Easter Cash,
Wester Cash and Cash Mill farms.

The American Cash connection came about in 1612 when mariner William Cash
sailed from Scotland to Salem, Massachusetts, with a boatload of pilgrims.
He later decided to settle in America.

The Cash name has also been linked to the clan MacKintosh.

In March 1998, Johnny’s daughter, Roseanne Cash, visited Falkland to see for
herself her family roots.

She told The Courier then that her interest was sparked by her father, who
in the 1970s began delving into the subject. Johnny himself visited Fife
several times in the 1990s to try to plug gaps in his family tree.

Yesterday Fife councillor for Falkland, Freuchie and Strathmiglo Ewen
Jardine said he had not been aware of the Johnny Cash connection with the
area until The Courier told him, but he was sure it would be of “great
interest”.

He said, “It’s always nice to hear about this sort of thing. Of course,
Auchtermuchty has its folk festival and it was the home of Sir Jimmy Shand.
So it just goes to show what big names this area can go on to produce.”

Cash—commonly dubbed “the man in black” after one of his most famous
songs—died from respiratory failure resulting from diabetes complications in
a Nashville hospital on Friday morning. He was 71.

He will be best remembered for recordings such as A Boy Named Sue, I Walk
The Line and Three Feet High and Rising
--
Scottish
Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Jim Stewart
Helen Ramsay
2003-09-17 14:49:19 UTC
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Thanks ***@ve :)

A W-S ! Don't get all bent out of shape because I top-posted. I had a good
reason.

Cheers, Helen
Post by Scottish
THE DEATH of country music legend Johnny Cash on Friday has brought into
focus his family's 800-year-old link with the Howe of Fife.
The US star could trace his ancestry back to King Malcolm IV of Scotland and
had links with the former country retreat of the Stuart kings at Falkland
Palace.
Records held by Falkland Palace show that King Malcolm awarded a large
estate to the Earl of Fife in 1160 when he married the king's niece, whose
name was Cash or Cashel. A 15th century map sited the estate between
Falkland and Strathmiglo.
The clan Cash originated from Malcolm's sister, Ada, and streets in
Strathmiglo and Falkland still carry the name Cash, as do Easter Cash,
Wester Cash and Cash Mill farms.
The American Cash connection came about in 1612 when mariner William Cash
sailed from Scotland to Salem, Massachusetts, with a boatload of pilgrims.
He later decided to settle in America.
The Cash name has also been linked to the clan MacKintosh.
In March 1998, Johnny's daughter, Roseanne Cash, visited Falkland to see
for
Post by Scottish
herself her family roots.
She told The Courier then that her interest was sparked by her father, who
in the 1970s began delving into the subject. Johnny himself visited Fife
several times in the 1990s to try to plug gaps in his family tree.
Yesterday Fife councillor for Falkland, Freuchie and Strathmiglo Ewen
Jardine said he had not been aware of the Johnny Cash connection with the
area until The Courier told him, but he was sure it would be of "great
interest".
He said, "It's always nice to hear about this sort of thing. Of course,
Auchtermuchty has its folk festival and it was the home of Sir Jimmy Shand.
So it just goes to show what big names this area can go on to produce."
Cash-commonly dubbed "the man in black" after one of his most famous
songs-died from respiratory failure resulting from diabetes complications
in
Post by Scottish
a Nashville hospital on Friday morning. He was 71.
He will be best remembered for recordings such as A Boy Named Sue, I Walk
The Line and Three Feet High and Rising
--
Scottish
Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be
waiting
Post by Scottish
on
Post by Jim Stewart
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225
groups....
Post by Jim Stewart
Jim Stewart
Helen Ramsay
2003-09-17 12:23:34 UTC
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Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
I remember seeing him on TV visiting Falkland Palace in Fife. I really don't
remember where or when, but it was probably on one of my trips home. The
only thing I could find when I searched Johnny Cash+Falkland Palace was
this...

http://www.parsonage.net/clanskene/archives/dan0398.htm

"Tom Skeen brought to my attention recently the fact that Johnny Cash's
autobiography places his family's origin in Fife - as it happens only about
two miles from where I am sitting. Cash is an old site, and is clearly
marked on Blaeuw's map of Fife dating from about 1650. I haven't yet seen
Johnny Cash's book, but apparently he mentions the parish of Strathmiglo,
which is where Cash is situated, and also the valley of Strath Braan. This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his origins. A
visit from him would be nice !! "

Cheers, Helen
MacHamish
2003-09-17 17:31:45 UTC
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On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his origins. A
visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.

MacHamish Mór
James C. Woodard
2003-09-17 17:50:22 UTC
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Post by MacHamish
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his
origins. A visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.
MacHamish Mór
That let's Paterson out. I hear he's a large.
--
James C. Woodard
"Too many laws make scofflaws of all"
http://www.aracnet.com/~gwyddon/
***@aracnet.com
Sally
2003-09-18 00:40:09 UTC
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Post by James C. Woodard
Post by MacHamish
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his
origins. A visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.
MacHamish Mór
That let's Paterson out. I hear he's a large.
Thanks to Johnny Cash's death and the question as to his Scottishness,
I now have proof that indeed the man who wrote the family history on
the Quarrier family, did indeed put down the truth. I'm never too
sure when people write facts without proof. The article on Strathmiglo
fits the book. One more family placed in Scotland and in a place -
Easter Cash between 1711 and 1798. Thank you ***@ve!
Lesley Robertson
2003-09-18 07:59:17 UTC
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Post by Sally
Thanks to Johnny Cash's death and the question as to his Scottishness,
I now have proof that indeed the man who wrote the family history on
the Quarrier family, did indeed put down the truth. I'm never too
sure when people write facts without proof. The article on Strathmiglo
fits the book. One more family placed in Scotland and in a place -
The trouble is that the Johnny Cash story seems to be based on the "everyone
with the same surname has the same ancestors" idea and the "every scot with
that name came from the same glen/village" idea, which just don't hold
water. Without knowing the sources for the genealogical information, it has
to be treated as "grey data". Birth, marriage and death registrations
started in 1855 in Scotland, before that we have to rely on church
registrations, and even the oldest and best of them are few in number before
the mid 17th century. For example, an alternative derivation for the "Cash"
surname could derive from cashel - someone who lived near a celtic religious
site (as opposed to someone being called Kirk because an ancestor lived near
a Kirk).
It COULD be true, but without the sources being quoted, I'm afraid I see it
as not proven.
Lesley Robertson
MacRobert
2003-09-18 15:19:38 UTC
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On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 09:59:17 +0200, "Lesley Robertson"
Post by Lesley Robertson
Post by Sally
Thanks to Johnny Cash's death and the question as to his Scottishness,
I now have proof that indeed the man who wrote the family history on
the Quarrier family, did indeed put down the truth. I'm never too
sure when people write facts without proof. The article on Strathmiglo
fits the book. One more family placed in Scotland and in a place -
The trouble is that the Johnny Cash story seems to be based on the "everyone
with the same surname has the same ancestors" idea and the "every scot with
that name came from the same glen/village" idea, which just don't hold
water. Without knowing the sources for the genealogical information, it has
to be treated as "grey data". Birth, marriage and death registrations
started in 1855 in Scotland, before that we have to rely on church
registrations, and even the oldest and best of them are few in number before
the mid 17th century. For example, an alternative derivation for the "Cash"
surname could derive from cashel - someone who lived near a celtic religious
site (as opposed to someone being called Kirk because an ancestor lived near
a Kirk).
It COULD be true, but without the sources being quoted, I'm afraid I see it
as not proven.
Lesley Robertson
What you say is true enough, but then it would spoil the Scottish
Midge we leftpondians hold so dear.

What? oh sorry, Scottish Midge is like Celtic Mist, only more
bloodthirsty.

MacR
Lesley Robertson
2003-09-18 15:42:16 UTC
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Post by MacRobert
What? oh sorry, Scottish Midge is like Celtic Mist, only more
bloodthirsty.
Oh no - the midge is real, and getting bigger teeth every year.....
Be afraid, be very afraid.....
One of these days they'll hitch a ride on a boat or plane and if you're not
ready.....
Lesley Robertson
MacRobert
2003-09-18 18:18:27 UTC
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On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:42:16 +0200, "Lesley Robertson"
Post by Lesley Robertson
Post by MacRobert
What? oh sorry, Scottish Midge is like Celtic Mist, only more
bloodthirsty.
Oh no - the midge is real, and getting bigger teeth every year.....
Be afraid, be very afraid.....
One of these days they'll hitch a ride on a boat or plane and if you're not
ready.....
Lesley Robertson
gnat to worry...
Duke of URL
2003-09-18 19:22:09 UTC
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Post by MacRobert
On Thu, 18 Sep 2003 17:42:16 +0200, "Lesley Robertson"
Post by Lesley Robertson
Post by MacRobert
What? oh sorry, Scottish Midge is like Celtic Mist, only more
bloodthirsty.
Oh no - the midge is real, and getting bigger teeth every year...
Be afraid, be very afraid...
One of these days they'll hitch a ride on a boat or plane and if
you're not ready...
gnat to worry...
They'll just fly away.
Greyrover
2003-09-19 03:47:14 UTC
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Post by Lesley Robertson
Post by MacRobert
What? oh sorry, Scottish Midge is like Celtic Mist, only more
bloodthirsty.
Oh no - the midge is real, and getting bigger teeth every year.....
Be afraid, be very afraid.....
One of these days they'll hitch a ride on a boat or plane and if you're not
ready.....
Lesley Robertson
Well, we could send some of the northern/Alaskan mosquitoes to Scotland.
I hear these mosquitoes are ferocious.

Greyrover
Ann Getty
2003-09-17 23:16:07 UTC
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Post by MacHamish
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his origins. A
visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.
MacHamish Mór
Does that mean we all sit together in the dark and hold hands?

Ann
Lesley Robertson
2003-09-18 07:59:56 UTC
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Post by Ann Getty
Post by MacHamish
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his
origins.
Post by Ann Getty
Post by MacHamish
Post by Helen Ramsay
A
visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.
MacHamish Mór
Does that mean we all sit together in the dark and hold hands?
Now THERE's a terrifying thought......
Lesley Robertson
MacHamish
2003-09-18 16:52:24 UTC
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Post by Ann Getty
Post by MacHamish
On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 08:23:34 -0400, "Helen Ramsay"
Post by Helen Ramsay
This
last point doesn't make sense, and I would really very much like to
communicate with the Man in Black to discuss what he knows of his origins. A
visit from him would be nice !! "
Do we have a medium in the group? We need a seance.
MacHamish Mór
Does that mean we all sit together in the dark and hold hands?
Yes, and we all get to play footsie under the table until Johnny shows up.

MacHamish Mór
d***@gmail.com
2017-08-23 19:22:38 UTC
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Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Jim Stewart
d***@gmail.com
2017-08-23 19:22:51 UTC
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Post by Jim Stewart
In the myrad of articles, ne stated John's family history. His family name
is Caesche an "Old Scottish Name???"
Anyone?
Oh, and his and June's favorite song was a gospel called "I'll be waiting on
the far bank of the Jordan" or something close to it. Recorded on several
albums and covered (If you can cover J Cash and J Carter) be 225 groups....
Jim Stewart
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