Discussion:
Scots speech accents
(too old to reply)
Frank Thomas
2005-01-08 04:15:25 UTC
Permalink
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that may
be noticed in their speech.

I am particularly interested if mainland Scots find the speech of the
Islands, such as Uist, Barra, and Tiree, to somehow sound different to their
ears than other parts, and if it is partcularly distinctive to their ears.

Thanks.
Nebulous
2005-01-08 07:09:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Thomas
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that may
be noticed in their speech.
I am particularly interested if mainland Scots find the speech of the
Islands, such as Uist, Barra, and Tiree, to somehow sound different to their
ears than other parts, and if it is partcularly distinctive to their ears.
Thanks.
It depends how close the person stays to the area you are talking about. The
further away they themselves stay, and the less local knowledge they have,
then the harder it becomes. I'm in Aberdeen, and would identify any of those
three accents as being from the Western Isles, but couldn't refine it any
more than that. Some other aeberdonians might only identify the accents as
being "Hielan."

Conversely other Scottish people might broadly recognise our accent as being
Doric, or from the North-East of Scotland, yet I could pick out individually
most of the local fishing villages, given a little bit of time to listen to
the speech.

Neb
John Crighton
2005-01-08 10:21:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Thomas
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that may
be noticed in their speech.
<snip>

Hello Frank,
back in the early 1960s I used to visit my granny in Glasgow
regularly, by taking the bus from Dunfermline in Fife. Back
then it was a two hour journey of about 45 to 50 miles.
The bus would stop to pick up and drop off passenger every
15 miles or so and I could hear the accents change as new
passengers came on the bus.

As a kid from Glasgow living in Fife, I was constantly reminded
that I was a Glesga Keelie and when I went to Glasgow to visit
my relatives I was regularly reminded that I was a wee Fifer noo.
I must have had some sort of combination accent that the locals
in Glasgow and Fife could easily pick out as being different to
them so they had to have a dig at me.

After decades of living in Australia my Scottish accent has
changed and some people here, think that I am Canadian,
so just for fun I say "No, Cedar Rapids, Iowa"
and they believe me for a short time. Heh heh heh...
I saw the name Cedar Rapids in the back of an electronic
manual and it just stuck in my mind as sounding like a pretty
nice place.
Anyway what I am leading up to tell you Frank, just recently
I met a newly arrived Scot from Glasgow and he immediately
picked me as being a Fifer, even after four decades of living
in Australia. Accents can stick, eh! Heh heh heh....

I can just pick the difference between Adelaide,
South Australia and Bisbane, Queensland accents and
those two cities are over a thousand miles apart. A local
Australian would do a lot better than me. And yet as a kid
back in Scotland I could distinctly hear the Scottish accent
change every 15 to 20 miles on that Dunfermline to Glasgow
bus. I wonder if I could, still hear the local accents change
today, if I travelled that same bus route. Intesesting! I'll find
out when I go back.
That was a good question Frank, thanks for that, brought
back some good memories.

Cheerio,
John Crighton
Sydney
Country_Chiel
2005-01-09 19:31:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Crighton
Post by Frank Thomas
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that may
be noticed in their speech.
<snip>
Hello Frank,
back in the early 1960s I used to visit my granny in Glasgow
regularly, by taking the bus from Dunfermline in Fife. Back
then it was a two hour journey of about 45 to 50 miles.
The bus would stop to pick up and drop off passenger every
15 miles or so and I could hear the accents change as new
passengers came on the bus.
As a kid from Glasgow living in Fife, I was constantly reminded
that I was a Glesga Keelie and when I went to Glasgow to visit
my relatives I was regularly reminded that I was a wee Fifer noo.
I must have had some sort of combination accent that the locals
in Glasgow and Fife could easily pick out as being different to
them so they had to have a dig at me.
After decades of living in Australia my Scottish accent has
changed and some people here, think that I am Canadian,
so just for fun I say "No, Cedar Rapids, Iowa"
and they believe me for a short time. Heh heh heh...
I saw the name Cedar Rapids in the back of an electronic
manual and it just stuck in my mind as sounding like a pretty
nice place.
Anyway what I am leading up to tell you Frank, just recently
I met a newly arrived Scot from Glasgow and he immediately
picked me as being a Fifer, even after four decades of living
in Australia. Accents can stick, eh! Heh heh heh....
I can just pick the difference between Adelaide,
South Australia and Bisbane, Queensland accents and
those two cities are over a thousand miles apart. A local
Australian would do a lot better than me. And yet as a kid
back in Scotland I could distinctly hear the Scottish accent
change every 15 to 20 miles on that Dunfermline to Glasgow
bus. I wonder if I could, still hear the local accents change
today, if I travelled that same bus route. Intesesting! I'll find
out when I go back.
That was a good question Frank, thanks for that, brought
back some good memories.
Cheerio,
John Crighton
Sydney
There are little or no regional accents here in New Zealand though Dunedin
is slightly different.It all depends when a country was settled. For example
in Scotland and *ngland in the olde days there was little transport and
people maybe moved a maximum of 5 miles all their life - hence regionalised
accents.

Country Chiel

Alan Hardie
2005-01-08 12:43:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Thomas
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that may
be noticed in their speech.
I am particularly interested if mainland Scots find the speech of the
Islands, such as Uist, Barra, and Tiree, to somehow sound different to their
ears than other parts, and if it is partcularly distinctive to their ears.
Having been many times on Uist and Barra - though not Tiree - I can say that
I can detect that the accents are distinctively Western Isles. I can't tell
the difference between the accents of each of the islands of the Western
Isles, though the locals could. With regard to the rest of the population of
Scotland - you may find that some individuals can't differentiate between a
Western Isles accent and any other "Highland" or "Island" accent.
Michilín
2005-01-08 15:41:30 UTC
Permalink
On Sat, 8 Jan 2005 12:43:17 -0000, "Alan Hardie"
Post by Alan Hardie
Post by Frank Thomas
I am curious to know if today in Scotland, people living in different
parts are able to identify where other Scots are from by any accent that
may
Post by Frank Thomas
be noticed in their speech.
I am particularly interested if mainland Scots find the speech of the
Islands, such as Uist, Barra, and Tiree, to somehow sound different to
their
Post by Frank Thomas
ears than other parts, and if it is partcularly distinctive to their ears.
Having been many times on Uist and Barra - though not Tiree - I can say that
I can detect that the accents are distinctively Western Isles. I can't tell
the difference between the accents of each of the islands of the Western
Isles, though the locals could. With regard to the rest of the population of
Scotland - you may find that some individuals can't differentiate between a
Western Isles accent and any other "Highland" or "Island" accent.
I think a Lewis accent is absolutely unmistakable compared to any
other Western Isles accent, especially the Skye accent. A Lewis accent
is so unique that even when a Lewisman sings I can tell almost
instantly that he's from Lewis!

Whenever a "v" sound appears at the end of a word in Gaelic, like
"sibh" ( said "shiv", meaning "you", plural/polite) people from Lewis
always say, "shoo" instead of "shiv".

I can also tell if someone is from Easter Ross, Caithness and the
northern Isles or the northwest Highlands, especially Sutherland
without any difficulty. Once one gets to Mull and farther south, the
accent changes again. On the mainland, south of Inverness, everyone
sounds like they're from Perth to me. On the East Coast I assume
they're all from Buckie or Aberdeen.

Now, as recipes are sliding back into favour, here's a typical
fisherman's supper recipe for the end of a hard day's applying for EU
grants in the Small Isles.

This of course blows the lid off the accepted wisdom that Hebrideans
live on the edge of starvation, whereas in fact most of us live like
royalty compared to the poor buggers on the mainland, hacking away at
their haggis and trying to convince themselves that they're having an
ethnic experience...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Grilled Salmon Tournedos with Fennel, Corn and Blueberry Salsa

Ingredients for 4 people
600g salmon, cut into strips
4 tbsp olive oil
salt & pepper

salsa
250 ml precooked corn kernels
60 ml olive oil
30 ml white wine
30 ml blueberries
15 ml red wine vinegar
6 small shiitake mushrooms
I shallot chopped
1 red pepper diced
1 fennel stalk diced
1 lemon
A little garlic
Salt & pepper

Making the salsa
1. Sweat the shallot in a little oil; add the white wine and reduce
until the liquid has completely evaporated; remove from the heat;
2. add the corn, the pepper, the fennel, the garlic and the remaining
olive oil; heat gently for a few minutes;
3. remove the mushroom stems; sauté just the caps in a separate
skillet;
4. combine all the ingredients; add the juice of one lemon; season and
keep warm.

Preparing the Salmon
1. Roll up two strips of salmon, one at a time, to form a tournedos
(it should resemble a thick round steak); use a toothpick to hold it
together;
2. brush with olive oil; season and grill for 4-5 minutes on each
side.

Chef's tip
Don't overcook the salmon. Cooking it slightly rare will give it a
softer, more tender texture.
The salsa can be served warm or cold and used with any fish, tastes
delicious with halibut.
The salmon tournedos are placed on wild rice and vegetables and served
with salsa and green asparagus which can be stood up by fixing them
with a small skewer.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Need a healthy lunchtime snack for the ould fella as he tramps the
hills trying to locate that missing yowe?

Send him on his way with smoked salmon wrapped around prawns in marie
rose sauce to make a parcel. Place several of these on top of a
delicious salad of different lettuce leaves with tomatoes, celery,
grapes with lemon slices for decoration. Wash it down with traditional
swallows of cold tea from a recycled Irn Bru bottle...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ah, the Western Islanders - we'll buy and sell you before you know
what's happening!

As the proverb says: "Bidh mìr a’ ghill’ èasgaidh air gach mèis - the
smart fellow's share is on every dish!"

(Actually, I have no idea what that means, but it sounds very
traditional, so I just tossed it in...)

Michilín
Frank Thomas
2005-01-08 14:37:58 UTC
Permalink
Thanks so much for all the replies I see, they were all very illuminating,
it is really very interesting. Let me expand on why I was asking the
question.

Not too long ago I met someone who knew my great-grandfather, who had lived
in that part of Canada where alot of Scots Gaels settled. It was kind of an
isolated place, the family had been pretty much in the same plot of land
since my 3Ggrandfather came over, the story passed on was they had come
from one of the western islands of Scotland.

Anyway, the person I met told me that my Great Grandfather spoke with a very
pronounced - they called it " a Gaelic accent", and sometimes used Gaelic
words in their speech, which they did not understand. I asked , (hard as it
is to ask), what it sounded like, and the best they could offer, was that he
spoke with sort of like a Scots accent, but they seemed hesitant to describe
it that way.

Then at about the same time I met someone who actually was from one of the
islands, Barra I think it was. She was an older person, and had been away
from home a very long time. Anyway, her speech was really intriguing, it
wasn't that broad, sort of rolling, soft spoken brogue that I hear most
often when I hear Scots speaking. In fact I would say, if I had not been
told ahead of time she had originally come from Scotland, I would have been
pressed to identify her as a Scot. From time to time her voice would take
on that quality , and I think eventually I would have figured out where
she was from.

Thus I was sort of wondering if it was possible that the accents in the
speech of the people who live on the Scottish western islands, might not be
a very old accent that changed little. Further, that the accent my
"informant" ascribed to my great grandfather, might not have been a
surviving relic of the voice of the islands from long ago.
Michilín
2005-01-08 19:41:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Frank Thomas
Thanks so much for all the replies I see, they were all very illuminating,
it is really very interesting. Let me expand on why I was asking the
question.
Not too long ago I met someone who knew my great-grandfather, who had lived
in that part of Canada where alot of Scots Gaels settled. It was kind of an
isolated place, the family had been pretty much in the same plot of land
since my 3Ggrandfather came over, the story passed on was they had come
from one of the western islands of Scotland.
Anyway, the person I met told me that my Great Grandfather spoke with a very
pronounced - they called it " a Gaelic accent", and sometimes used Gaelic
words in their speech, which they did not understand. I asked , (hard as it
is to ask), what it sounded like, and the best they could offer, was that he
spoke with sort of like a Scots accent, but they seemed hesitant to describe
it that way.
Then at about the same time I met someone who actually was from one of the
islands, Barra I think it was. She was an older person, and had been away
from home a very long time. Anyway, her speech was really intriguing, it
wasn't that broad, sort of rolling, soft spoken brogue that I hear most
often when I hear Scots speaking. In fact I would say, if I had not been
told ahead of time she had originally come from Scotland, I would have been
pressed to identify her as a Scot. From time to time her voice would take
on that quality , and I think eventually I would have figured out where
she was from.
Thus I was sort of wondering if it was possible that the accents in the
speech of the people who live on the Scottish western islands, might not be
a very old accent that changed little. Further, that the accent my
"informant" ascribed to my great grandfather, might not have been a
surviving relic of the voice of the islands from long ago.
No doubt about it. My wife was Nova Scotian and my distant relation,
which got me into the Canadian Gaelic scene and I noticed that some of
the older people spoke with the accent of the island their ancestors
came from. That is to say, I heard both Lewis and Skye accents on the
lips of Canadian Gaels.

Michilín
Cory Bhreckan
2005-01-09 01:29:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Michilín
Post by Frank Thomas
Thanks so much for all the replies I see, they were all very illuminating,
it is really very interesting. Let me expand on why I was asking the
question.
Not too long ago I met someone who knew my great-grandfather, who had lived
in that part of Canada where alot of Scots Gaels settled. It was kind of an
isolated place, the family had been pretty much in the same plot of land
since my 3Ggrandfather came over, the story passed on was they had come
from one of the western islands of Scotland.
Anyway, the person I met told me that my Great Grandfather spoke with a very
pronounced - they called it " a Gaelic accent", and sometimes used Gaelic
words in their speech, which they did not understand. I asked , (hard as it
is to ask), what it sounded like, and the best they could offer, was that he
spoke with sort of like a Scots accent, but they seemed hesitant to describe
it that way.
Then at about the same time I met someone who actually was from one of the
islands, Barra I think it was. She was an older person, and had been away
from home a very long time. Anyway, her speech was really intriguing, it
wasn't that broad, sort of rolling, soft spoken brogue that I hear most
often when I hear Scots speaking. In fact I would say, if I had not been
told ahead of time she had originally come from Scotland, I would have been
pressed to identify her as a Scot. From time to time her voice would take
on that quality , and I think eventually I would have figured out where
she was from.
Thus I was sort of wondering if it was possible that the accents in the
speech of the people who live on the Scottish western islands, might not be
a very old accent that changed little. Further, that the accent my
"informant" ascribed to my great grandfather, might not have been a
surviving relic of the voice of the islands from long ago.
No doubt about it. My wife was Nova Scotian and my distant relation,
which got me into the Canadian Gaelic scene and I noticed that some of
the older people spoke with the accent of the island their ancestors
came from. That is to say, I heard both Lewis and Skye accents on the
lips of Canadian Gaels.
Michilín
If they were native Gaelic speakers wouldn't they speak *nglish with the
accent of whoever taught them that language?
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